BUILDING KIT CARS/Fiber glass

[GSHME]

Any one tell me what the market is like for building kit cars or fiber glass products and which is popular?

[niky]

There are a few high-profile companies, as far as I know... the one that builds the Cobra replicas and the GT111 electric sportscar (that will be built in the UK, though...)... then there's one or two units building VW dune buggies... and the other one building micro-jeep bodies.

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The market is a bit small, though... unless you have something fantastic selling for a good price. Or something beyond fantastic, even if it sells for a high price.

[GSHME]

Ok I was looking at Porsche 917, Lambo's etc... cobra's are like noses every one has one.. Maybe Hot rods,, What you pay is what you get but USA in trouble its a good time for cheap engines and kits Merc V12 $750 USD.

[ghosthunter]

Instead of something too far out like the Porsche 917, Lambo. etc .... why not something more down to earth like the Porsche 356?

[GSHME]

Just as much trouble to build a 356 as it is to do a lambo, still need engine, tranny, wheels frame etc, you can get lambo bodies from USS for around 5K USD means you can have a car in months not years.
Be happy to make canopies for Owners/ Carry's even..

[ghosthunter]

Just as much trouble to build a 356 as it is to do a lambo, still need engine, tranny, wheels frame etc, you can get lambo bodies from USS for around 5K USD means you can have a car in months not years.
Be happy to make canopies for Owners/ Carry's even..

I just think you will have a bigger market (in the Philippines) if you cater to the classic replicas than in super car replicas.

[niky]

The difference is you can power a 356 kit (there are a few here) with a VW flat-four.

You'll need a US-sourced V8 or V12 (like the Merc you cited) to make a Lambo. So it only costs $750 over there. That's under 35k pesos. You'd still need to pay import tax. And importation costs. Say that's 80k worth of engine. Does that include the transmission? The wiring harness? Bull if that's a full engine... a fully dressed Merc V12 should set you back about $2k*, minimum... which would be around 150-200k pesos imported.

Then you'd have to figure out how to wire it. Pay some electrician 20k to do the work. Worst case scenario, you'll need a full standalone, cheapest at 25k pesos, more realistically, you'll spend 50k pesos.

A $5k body imported, considering the large size of the kit, maybe translates to about 350k pesos (guesstimate) landed here with proper taxes.

Then you'd need the frame, (those 5k bodies require a Fiero frame, mind you), which is not available locally. So you'll have to build one, and build a custom suspension, too. Likely total cost would be around 1.5 million pesos. You'll have to sell it retail at 3 million pesos to even come close to making it worth your while.

This is why Cobra turnkeys cost about 1.5m here. There's a lot of stuff that goes into building these kits beyond the kit and engine. And a lot of the cheap parts, accessories, suspension and frame kits that make it easy in the US don't exist here. You'd have to import them (and pay shipping and tax on them) from the US.

The way to do it cheap would be to drop the body on top of an MR2 (hard to find Fieros here). Say about 600k for a good MR2 turbo, 350k for the kit body, 100k labor, then you'd still have to do a lot of fiddling to make it fit well... and a lot more to give it the same performance as a Lambo... so not much less money...

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*Looking at E-Bay, that's actually conservative. For $500-$1000, you get POS motors that either have more miles on them than an LA Hooker, are in need of a serious (expensive) rebuild or are ancient enough to have the equivalent performance of a modest four banger. Or all three. For a decent V12 (at least 300 hp), you'll be paying $2,700 - $4,000, and that doesn't include the transmission necessary to hook up to that engine. A decent mid-engined transmission will set you back a pretty penny. Probably cost more than the motor itself. That brings your project cost alone up to the 2m range. that's not an easy sell.

[GSHME]

Only need one kit and build from that, chassis make your own here and use local suspension./steering/ wiring brakes etc from a donor car front cut wreck.

Don't know what the import duty is but sounds high for some reason.
All depends on the finish you want.
Could be pay as you go.

[niky]

I've imported car parts from the US, and the tax is steep. Shipping depends on how long you're willing to wait.

Major parts, taxes are higher... if you bring in a chassis, you have to convince customs it's not a whole car, or they'll slap you with a 100% tax.

The big problem you're looking at is how much the chassis is going to cost. Having a shop fabricate a simple frame chassis like a Locost here will cost around 100k pesos or so. Having them fabricate something meant to hold a V12, double-wishbones and the like would cost three times more.

Then you'd have to source the mechanical parts, as well.

Cobra kits work because the only major and difficult part is the engine. The rest of the mechanicals are simple. Rear wheel drive live axle, ladder-frame, and possibly a Japanese front-end. And that's already around 1 - 1.5m retail here (as I mentioned).

Dune buggy, 356 and Porsche Speedster... some of the cosmetic bits are difficult, but you can use a VW frame in its entirety. That's 50-60k only for a runner.

What you need to look at is what the locally available raw materials are, and decide what kind of kit will work. Something like the K1 Attack, which sources 90% of its parts from the Honda Accord, would work. You can buy a secondhand Accord for 100k, sell off the parts you don't need for about 20k, and then slap all the mechanicals into the car.

Another group here created a spaceframe mid-engined sportscar around the Honda B16. The engine is expensive here (100k pesos with fuel tank, transmission and box), but it's available.

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What's simple in the US is not simple here. Contrawise, some things that you can do very simply here, like a GT-R powered Cefiros (Cefiro, 100k for a runner, less for a junker... rear-wheel drive, compatible with Nissan GT-R parts), are things that you can't do in the US.

[GSHME]

Agree your LTO rules are nothing like USA and getting worse each year.
I was looking at making my own chassis which will save on labour but still cost. So maybe look at F/glass canopies, or easy ones like making Defender bodies on an owner would not be hard to do as most of the Panels are straight if you can convince the locals
F/glass is the way to go and not Vinyl.